Behind The Stream: Interview with an Influencer
Ever felt like your video marketing isn’t quite hitting the mark? Or maybe you’re thinking, “I know videos are powerful, but… where do I start?”
We’ve been there, and here’s the thing: it’s not about just making a video. It’s about making the right video.
And most importantly, it’s about making sure that video works for your brand and your audience.
That’s exactly what we’re diving into with this week’s Behind The Stream We sat down with Eli Harwood, owner of Attachment Nerd and Influencer. We took a hard look at what makes a video truly connect with its audience.
It’s strategy, storytelling, and execution.
If your video doesn’t hit all the right notes, it won’t do much for you.
Eli: Hi! I’m Eli Harwood. I am a therapist, and I started The Attachment Nerd. So what I do a lot of is running my mouth on the internet. And I also have courses that I sell, and I have a membership that I sell, and I write books, and I raise children, and I don’t know—what else do I do?
Beth: That’s perfect.
Eli: That’s mostly what I do.
Beth: You run your mouth on the internet. And I actually had to pull these numbers because they’re just too impressive. So you have—you run your mouth to 165,000 followers on TikTok. You run your mouth to 300—these are your words—I think 386,000 people on Facebook. And on Instagram, you run your mouth to 558,000 people. That’s half—over half a million people. When did you start the channels? When did you start the social media?
Eli: February of 2022.
Beth: How quickly did it work?
Eli: So TikTok took off really fast. Okay, I mean, I think I was on my seventh or eighth video or something.
Beth: Really?! You just got follower, follower, follower?
Eli: Something went viral.
Beth: Something went viral.
Eli: Yeah, and then I started to kind of learn virality a little bit. I’m like, oh, this is what people—this is what’s getting people to share, to comment, to like, to engage. What is it? Oh, they’re feeling something. So it’s fairly quickly with TikTok. But I was taking my TikTok videos and putting them onto Instagram, and TikTok has a watermark, so Instagram wasn’t sending my videos out, which was like a rookie mistake.
Beth: I was just gonna say that they don’t like it.
Eli: Finally, another creator was like, “You know, you need to take the watermark off,” and I was like—but as soon as I did that, it took off pretty quickly there too.
Beth: Okay.
Eli: So my—I mean, I have a strange experience with social media. So some of the people watching this are like, “I hate her seriously right now. Like, that’s so annoying. I’ve been working so hard on this. I’ve been putting it in.” And I’m like, that’s fair.
Beth: I—that might be true. My audience is more people that won’t start.
Eli: Okay.
Beth: So I—and it’s not even that they won’t start, but a lot of it is they maybe get a little traction. They’ll maybe do one video, they’ll tip their toe in, but they have ambitions of creating kind of the content—
Eli: Of doing this.
Beth: Truly. Like, they’ll come to me—I can’t tell you how many conversations I have with, “Here’s the idea, here’s what I want to do. I want to do it like this. I want to say it like this.” And I’m like, “Yes, yep, go and do it.” In fact, one person who we’ve done professional videos for came and told me all of these ideas, and he’s like, “Would you look at them if I do some of these vlog ideas that I have?” And I was like, “I will give you two hours of free consulting if you get them to me in—like, if you do them in the next week.” Never did them. That is the story that I have. So I think—and this is also my personal belief, just based on how we’re into the online marketing world—we’re very like, “I’m into it. I want to do more in it.” So I experience all of these things that people experience. I just have this—I have to. I can’t sell video in good conscience if I don’t create videos for online. And there’s so many—so I—and when we talked about this last time and why I wanted to actually make you come on camera for everybody—because you said, “You know, I have 17 years of experience. I talk about these things all the time.” I don’t actually— like, that is also typically the credentials of the people we’re working with. Like, which I think is great. I’m not saying that that’s nothing, but like, how did you take that and turn on the camera? And specifically, I’m going to just say, like, how did you not hate your appearance? And I’m not—you shouldn’t. You look great. But so do most of the people that we’re talking to. Okay, how did you not worry so much about what you were going to say and how it was going to be received? How did you not think about, you know, what else do people—we like to do a behind-the-scenes vibe—like, what else do people think of? Like, why they don’t—why they don’t like, they haven’t figured out their message or articulated it just—
Steph: I think a lot of times it feels overwhelming to try to figure out an editing software.
Beth: Yes, yes. Or just my lighting, my composition. Thank you. Yes. So, like, how did you—like this shot? Like, you didn’t do your first shot and then like, “Oh, there’s a shadow on my face. Shut it down. The end of story.”
Eli: Yeah. No. Okay, so I love the idea of like the minimum viable product. So I’ve already like been brainwashed in that from my husband who does geeky things. Like, I do have a belief that the best things we create in life, we just birth it, and we trust that process. Like, we don’t edit ourselves. So when you’re like, “How did you do that? How did you look at yourself and not see all the things?” First of all, I want to say I see all the things.
Beth: Okay, good, just ’cause that’s human! Not because you should!
Eli: I definitely see all the things. I’m like, “My eyebrows look weird,” and I’m like, “Oh, the zit and the thing,” like, I see all the things. But what I tell myself is, when I’m looking at other people, what do I care about? Do I want them to look flawless? Do I want them to look like, you know, a model? Or do I want to feel something? I want to be moved. I want to connect. And honestly, I want to feel like, “You have zits? Great! Me too!” You know? Yeah. This is where being a therapist has come into this.
Beth: And that might be part of it.
Eli: I’ve done a lot of my own therapy. I’ve worked through some of that stuff. I’ve had to, like, process. You know, I think even as a woman, like, processing the way that how I look can often be valued more than what I have to say, and I’m angry about that in a way that motivates me to be like—
Beth: To be like, “I just finished a workout, let’s go.”
Eli: “I got things to say!” I think—so I spent a lot of time healing myself and the parts of myself that have felt rejected in the world or underestimated or undervalued. So I think at this point in my life—I couldn’t have done this at 20 years old. There’s no way. I would have just been—I would have like, done two videos and then cried and crumbled and then been like, “I didn’t want to do that anyway.”
Beth: So you are in touch with that very real feeling that a lot of us have about doing this kind of thing.
Eli: Yes. And like, most of it sounds like the people you’re describing—I have like a really deep passion for what I’m talking about. I really want this information out there. So—and maybe that is different for some folks. Like, I’m not just trying to create a campaign in order to help my business grow. I love that part of it. That’s an important part of it. But I’m like, this is my life mission. And so I think there’s a sense that, like, I feel almost like a duty to do it. I’m like, “I got stuff to say. I need to say it.” And like, I’m going to look frumpy and off, and I actually very intentionally do videos where I’m “did up” and videos where I am not “did up,” because I want people to know me—and to have permission for that for themselves. I think that’s the other thing—so I do think I want people to be able to be like, “Oh wow, she looks really different when she doesn’t have makeup on.”
Eli: Yeah, I do.
Beth: And the message is still the same.
Eli: Nothing—like, and some of my most viral videos have been like that—and so I think like that’s important to remember, like, you’re not—it’s not about putting on a show for people. It’s about showing up with people and showing up with yourself.
Beth: And showing up with yourself. That might be the bigger—because I actually—one of the things that I—one of the arguments I’ve tried to make over the years is, because a lot of people that I talk to, you know, I meet networking, or they come to events, and they stand up and they pitch their business, or they’ll call and we talk about getting in-person meetings, and I’m like, “You’re not afraid to show up to the meeting and say who you are and what you do. You’re not afraid to be like, you know, if a client is interested in what you have to do, that you’re going to go to that meeting, and you’re not going to let your insecurities or whatever it is you don’t like about yourself stop you from going to that meeting.” But for whatever reason—and I definitely think that one of the biggest things for me when I think about being on camera is, let your why be bigger than your insecurities. Like, think about your audience and who you’re helping. That’s always a really good tip, but it’s sometimes not enough because I think a lot of our clients—a lot of our potential clients are still—I don’t know, it’s like that—just that force is bigger.
Eli: There’s something I would say that’s a trauma thing that—
Beth: Yeah, right.
Eli: So if I’m like, if I’m coming to the camera and I feel completely paralyzed about the possibility of someone mocking me or shaming me or humiliating me, what are the roots of that? Was that bullying that happened in grad school? Was that the way that my caregivers responded to me? Like, is that internalized racism, internalized homophobia? Like, what is the thing that’s making me not trust my body and not trust that my presence is more valuable than my appearance?
Eli: Because that’s the truth. Like, our presence is what draws us into people. We might like looking at people that are, you know, aesthetically pleasing.
Beth: That’s not really who’s—
Eli: And honestly, I actually think the world is kind of over that right now. I do. I think we’ve kind of gotten past that to some degree. Like, I keep watching like who’s coming up more and more, and I’m like, it’s real people. I don’t know—
Beth: Like if you watch CNN or like sports, you’re like, “Who are these fake people on? I don’t like—what? Where?” Yeah, I do totally agree.
Eli: You’re like, “Is that real?” I don’t know. It’s just like—it doesn’t draw you in. I think maybe like it did decades past when you were kind of stuck in some of that mythology.
Beth: Yeah.
Eli: But I feel like now people want to be with real people. And so it’s about being like, what’s my story? What have I worked through in my story? What have I not worked through in my story? And then what’s the story I’m wanting to bring to people? What’s the hope? What’s the inspiration? What’s the—you know, advantage I want to give people in their lives—like, what am I bringing to others? And then how do I do that in a way that’s authentically me?
Beth: Okay, so go back to it. Because logistically—so you start doing viral videos, or you start doing videos. You said it was like the seventh or eighth one, you kind of think. So when did you start like intentionally making choices about not being “done up” and being “done up”? And like—
Eli: That actually took me a little while—
Beth: Okay, so you were “done up” at first?
Eli: And I had a friend say to me, “You look so beautiful in all of your videos.”
Beth: Like, as a compliment.
Eli: Yep. And I was like, “That’s not in line with my value system.” And I was like—kind of nerve-wracking the first time that I was like, nothing on. And I’m 41 years old, and I’ve got wrinkles and consistent acne and, you know, it’s just like, “Oh, well, that’s good.” I mean, I could put the makeup—I got the makeup on right now.
Beth: Today, you’re—today you’re in full makeup.
Eli: But I like had this panic moment, but I also just talked to my younger self. I was like talking to my like inner junior high or high schooler and being like, “Nobody can reject you. Like, you’re okay.” This is why I said, I don’t think I could have done this in my 20s. In my 40s, I’ve got a lot more like, “What you see is what you get. People, you don’t like it? That’s fine. Move along.” I didn’t have as much of that earlier in my life, but maybe there are some 20-year-olds that have that. But I think there’s a sense of like, that wasn’t in my value system. Okay, I’m going to try and tune this. And then I just started doing it. And then the more I did it, I mean, I actually like—I feel really proud of myself.
Beth: You should!
Eli: I’m like, I’ve been authentically myself on video, and I hope, like, anyone who’s watching it can feel more permission to be whatever they want to—express yourself or whatever feels right. Sometimes I need to express myself in like, all sweatpants and maybe some macaroni and cheese on my shirt because I have children. And then sometimes I’m going to express myself with all of the earrings and the ups and the things—and like, that—that I get to choose that.
Eli: And I get to trust what it is that I bring to the table. But I’m going to do that not out of fear or not out of like, I’m trying to be liked or loved. I do this because I am extra. I love playing dress-up. I’ve joked with you about this before, but like, I came out of my mother’s uterus like, “Where are my accessories and where is the stage?” And so that’s authentically me.
Beth: Yes, yes.
Eli: You know, like, my recommendation would never be to people like—
Eli & Beth: Get some earrings!
Eli: No, like, I don’t know—like, do you love earrings? Like, okay, get some earrings, but like, it’s more like, listen to that deep inner true space in your body and move from there.
Beth: Yeah, I actually think that is really—because it’s—we’ve talked a lot about, you know, like watching you just today—it was gestures and the way your tone of voice—that is all absolutely teachable for people that are not… are not intuitively good at that. Everything’s teachable, and it’s not really about that. It’s—and I always say that to people too, like, you don’t need gestures. Gestures are not like an empirical fact to being a good presenter.
Eli: Some people hate them?
Beth: Some people are very bad at gestures.
Eli: Oh no. Or hate watching them.
Beth: Or hate watching your gestures.
Eli: I get feedback. I got—I had this one video where I was going like—and people are like, “I feel like you’re in a poke. Me, what’s happening?” Like, I got—I can get—I get negative feedback for the fact that I flail.
Beth: No, see, and I—so I actually really like that you flail.
Eli: Totally.
Beth: But it’s not—messages are very much about the person. And I think that that is what I’m hearing is that you are able to connect with the part of yourself that you truly believe is valuable, that what you have to say is valuable. You’re literally able to make that true connection and not let all of that noise stop you.
Eli: Yes, and I’m not doing it to try to be valuable. So this is really tricky because I think—
Beth: Oh God, okay.
Eli: Like, if everyone unfollowed me tomorrow, it would suck, but I’d be okay.
Beth: Yeah.
Eli: Genuinely, I’d be okay. And I do not believe that I would be more valuable or less valuable. And I honestly do not think—like, it’s funny to watch people who’ve known me, like, watch this whole thing happen. And like, even you were so cute when you were like, “I’m kind of a little, like, fan-girly about this.”
Eli: And I’m like, “What do you—?” That does not resonate for me because I don’t see this as connected to my value. I’m like, this is fun. This is meaningful. It has been so cool to create a community of this many people—I still can’t even believe. But also, my brain doesn’t understand numbers—like, that doesn’t make sense.
Eli: But it’s not like I became cooler or more special or more anything. I just have an audience.
Beth: Okay, that I get. I don’t know—I like, feel like I’m trying to talk her out of, like, what—but I think, like, your message—what you, I think you said to me when we talked about this, your message is to make the world a little bit less traumatized. And that’s—that’s what you’re going into these videos thinking—that’s what you’re doing.
You’re not trying to drive sales to this online course. That online course serves that bigger mission. The value, though, is in your message and in this—like, I guess that’s what I’m trying to unpack a little bit, is you believe in what you’re doing and what you’re teaching, and you believe in—and this is me paraphrasing what you came up—kind of already said—you did say it was your duty? You did say duty?
I was like—I almost wanted to make a duty joke. I was like, “No, I know that’s the word you used.” Your responsibility to bring this message to more people if you are capable. And so for that, it became pretty clear—it’s going to be—there’s these social media channels. I know I can do this. I even want to do this because I’m not really afraid to be on camera. I’m not afraid to talk. This seems fun. You came up against all that stuff—all of that fear, all of that—how you look. And you were like, “I’m not going to feed that. That’s not really the thing that matters here,” because of your work in therapy, because you’re a healthy individual.
Eli: And I was already not feeding that in other places.
Beth: You were already not feeding that in other places. So that might be a bigger—that’s, I guess, what I’m trying to get to—that might be a bigger place to start for people is like, if you are so terrified to be on camera because of all of these things, like, don’t take an on-camera class. Like, maybe go see a therapist or maybe do some work.
Eli: Yeah, get into the place where you’re like, “I am comfortable and connected and secure in my body and in my self, and I’m not offering—” I also don’t get on camera and think, “I’m going to say something brilliant or I’m going to say something important that no one else could ever say in this way.” I don’t do that. I’m like, “I have a thought—” and that, like, allows the thought to come out freely and less edited and less labor.
Beth: And then there’s no attachment to the thought.
Eli: I mean, it’s just more like—it’s like trusting my brain almost. It’s just like, my brain has something to say. And again, what do I like from other people? Like, it’s not like, “Oh my gosh, I’ve never heard something so poetic in my life.” It’s like, “Wow, I love the way you said that because you just said it.”
Beth: We like other teachers. We like people too—
Eli: Yeah, yeah. And I think, I mean, most of the content, especially on TikTok, is someone who’s like kind of just in the moment being like—
Beth: “I’m pissed off!” And yeah—
Eli: I’m like, that’s what draws us in because we all can feel that. So I mean—and I will tell you, I like—all my videos do not go viral. In fact, I have not had a really good viral one in a while, and that’s been bugging me. You get—you get addicted, you get weirdly addicted to it.
Beth: Oh, I can only imagine.
Eli: But—but so like, I will have stuff that just—like I did this morning that just went—and you never know why. Like, it could be the algorithm. It could be I wasn’t awake enough while I was doing it—I just, my energy was off. It could be my outfit was off, or the lighting was off. Does my—make another video. And don’t overanalyze it. Make another video. But the video I made, I liked. I enjoyed that process. I thought the thinking was interesting, and maybe only like 300 people are liking it instead of what’s normal for me. That’s okay.
Beth: Okay, so—and that’s—keep making videos. I really like that too. But okay, so—and I think there are some of our people that are probably struggling more with the logistics of it. So walk us through the logistics of this morning’s video or just like how you get—how many times do you post a week?
Eli: Well, I try to post around five times a week, but I say 4 to 5 times a week.
Beth: And when you started, you said you were posting multiple times a day.
Eli: Multiple times a day.
Beth: So how did you like logistically pull that off?
Eli: Okay, well, I have—my own company, so I can work on the hours that I want to work. So I had three full days to dedicate to this.
Beth: When you first started?
Eli: Yes.
Beth: Really!? Okay, I guess I didn’t know that part. Okay.
Eli: So that is a big difference. I had a lot of time around it. I think of my—it’s like, think of your social media space or wherever you’re making videos like this is your variety show, okay? So you want it to be full of variety—one, so that you don’t get bored, but also so that other people kind of want to keep coming back and think whatever you’re doing is interesting. So I sort of have in my brain that there’s these like different types of content that I can make. So there might be content where I’m giving advice, or content where I’m telling a story, or content where I’m, you know, acting something out or giving an example or answering a question from a comment on another thing—content where I’m walking, content where I’m in my house, content where I’m not in my house, like content where I’m not talking or I’m doing a voiceover. But so there’s just like—it’s like a kind of just think like, “Well, what next thing could I do and could I try?” And so many things I’ve done—but I mean, I don’t know how many videos I’ve made now, probably a thousand.
Beth: Oh yeah, I would imagine.
Eli: But I—they’re just like—they don’t resonate, they don’t hit. It doesn’t matter. And it’s just like, it’s just trusting your creative process.
Beth: It’s also showing up. Yeah. And doing the work. Yeah. Do you read Seth Godin? I doubt that you’re like into marketing.
Eli: Oh, I think I know who he is. He wrote a cow book?
Beth: Yes, he did! I remember cow!
Eli: Okay, I didn’t read it though.
Beth: You guys are very like—what you’re saying. He wasn’t like—he talks about if you have a product or a service that you believe in, you have the same responsibility—I’m going to botch this—to market it as we give responsibility to the people who marketed Marlboro cigarettes or whom—does that make sense? Like that’s how powerful marketing is. And so if you have a solution and you’re not doing it, you’re as culpable as the people that had this terrible product that did do it. So that kind of responsibility thing, I think that can help us transcend—
Eli: The insecure part.
Beth: The insecure part, but I think—I don’t think you can do it if you’re insecure. I mean, I don’t know, somebody prove me wrong. But I think if you don’t do that work, there’s not going to be enough tips, there’s not going to be enough tricks.
Eli: I don’t think you can do it if you let the insecurity drive. Because we all have insecurities.
Beth: Yes, yes, yes.
Eli: So it’s more about, okay, I noticed the insecurity. There it is. “Hello, insecurity, my old friend.” And then you’re like, “Yeah, that’s not going to work. I’m just going to have to do it and trust the process.” And sometimes we’ll do something and get a lot of negative feedback, and then you have to not let that feed the insecurity.
Beth: Right. Like—
Eli: Oh, that was feedback. That was information for me about what I’m going to do or not do.
Beth: So I think—and then the other piece that I was thinking is, well, that he talks about—this is also Seth Godin—is that like his like number one tip for marketers or writers—he’s a writer specifically—is to show up every single day. And that’s actually Jerry Seinfeld too—like, if you like, just write, just write, just get on video. Just do it. Posting is great because you get that feedback loop, but I’m wondering too, if there’s a practice in just doing so many videos that you might find your way to a video you’ll feel confident enough in posting.
Eli: Yeah, you see, you’re talking about batching.
Beth: Yes. Love to batch.
Eli: I mean, I think I said this to you in a different meeting, but I would say of maybe my top five viral videos, like three of them were all recorded within an hour of each other, and I think that is because I got into an energy state.
Eli: I got into a mind state, and like one thought spiral to the next, barrel to the next, and I sort of like had an equation going that was just really working at that point in time. I changed outfits for each video so they look like—
Beth: These are all tips.
Eli: Yep—taped at different times. But yeah, so I will sometimes on a day—I’ll start my morning, I’ll have like maybe a list of the videos I’m going to do, but sometimes I don’t even have that list. Maybe I just know one thing, and I just start, and I get dressed, and I do the video, and then whatever it is that, like, is springing from that, that I might do in another video or another video. And ideally, I would make all my videos in one day and then post them throughout the week.
Beth: Yeah.
Eli: And when I make a video, I do it in clips. Not everybody does, but for me, it’s the most helpful. I just use my camera on my head, and I say one sentence at a time. So… “Three tips to help your children learn to calm down faster.” Click. “Number one. Make your body smaller. When we make our body smaller, it allows our children to feel more safe in our presence, blah blah blah blah blah.” Click. “Number two.” And the reason I do that is because it helps my brain just get real clean on what I’m saying versus when we tend to like, try to process verbally. Sometimes we get the ums and the yeah—that’s when you often lose people because they’re watching you and they’re like, “Get to the point.” If you’re—if there’s a point in every clip. Now, now I’m hooked on that point and that point and that point versus waiting to figure out what you’re trying to say to me.
Beth: And that’s pretty in vogue with editing right now.
Eli: Is that?
Beth: Yes. Like that’s what we just tried to—we just did a series where we tried to make more like TikTok videos versus our more professional look, and that’s how you cut them, right? You just like, clipped me every time I started to ramble on about nonsense. To get up to my next point, which was there, and then we just went to it, which we—not, for the record, could not do when we started editing. It’s called a jump cut. And it was like very bad. Okay. So just so you know, we’re all learning.
Eli: It’s hard.
Beth: It’s very hard, especially because social media is like changed everything about how we think of our medium.
Eli: That’s a whole other thing. That’s a whole other view.
Beth: Yeah, totally.
Eli: So then I have CapCut on my phone. And so I go into my CapCut app, and I push “add,” and it allows me to integrate as many videos as I want into one video. So it stitches it all together.
Beth: So it does the editing for you.
Eli: Some of it. Okay. So then I click, click click click click click click. So now it’s put all these seven videos into one thing. Now I’m going to still need to edit a little bit because there is maybe—I use a clicker. Also, if anyone doesn’t have a clicker, those are the best things to have. So you click on it. You don’t have to get up and push the thing on your phone. So it’s a Bluetooth connected, so you can have it in your phone, and you’re talking, and you click, and then you click, okay.
Beth: Yeah, it’s a very practical.
Eli: Sometimes you can hear the clicker in the thing. So then, you know, it’s really very simple. You like click on this and you shorten that clip till that’s out. Add captions—captions will be on every video. Most people are watching their phones when they shouldn’t be—
Beth: Double screening. I learned that term today!
Eli: Yes!
Beth: Double screening all the time.
Eli: While their kids are watching Cocomelon, you’re like just trying not to hate your life. So you need—you need the captions on. So I always add auto captions, and then you kind of have to, like, go through and edit. And then I usually like add one, maybe title at the very beginning to try and capture people so they know, like, there’s something of value in this video for me. Sometimes you can hook people at the beginning just with what you’re saying. Like, “Today at the bus stop, I have a story to tell you.” And a lot of times just that—”I have a story to tell you.” “I don’t know who needs to hear this.” It’s a great little hook. “Here are some tips on blah, blah, blah.” So you’re hooking at the very, very beginning. You are telling this person, “Here’s what—here’s why you’re watching my video. This is what I’m going to give you.” And then you’re going to give them that video. So that title at the very beginning I sometimes put on—you want to identify yourself in some way, shape or form, like, who the hell are you there?
Beth: “So why do you get on the internet?”
Eli: So like sometimes I will do that verbally where I’ll be like, “Hi, I’m Eli, I’m a licensed therapist, blah blah blah blah.” Although I stopped doing that recently because I have a big following. So people are like, “Well, you know, you’re Eli.” But or I’ll put like “therapist tip,” and then it’s like. I’m gonna get a tip and this is who it’s from. So like, you know, bankers insight, whatever, whoever your thing is, and then you upload it to your phone. So after—
Beth: On CapCut.
Eli: On CapCut, so there’s a little button, there’s an arrow and you like upload it. Now you have that stitched together video. That’s one video. And then you take that one video and you can put it on TikTok, on Instagram, on Facebook, wherever it is that you want it to be. And from there you can like add music if you want to or add other bells and whistles, but CapCut lets you like put on emojis and stickers. I do this thing called the Fairy Psych Mother.
Beth: This is part of like one of your characters.
Eli: Yes. One of my characters. She’s a like your fairy godmother, but she’s your fairy like mother. So you’re like, so I like, we’ll have a character who’s, like, melting down about something. And then she comes into the screen, and every time she comes into the screen, she goes—but then I always put on the terrible, like, glittery just. It’s cheesy, it’s funny cheesy.
Beth: No, no, no, but yes, yes, yes.
Eli: So like I’ll do that in CapCut. But if I was adding music, I should do that on the platforms because you want to get in trouble for putting music on a platform that doesn’t, that isn’t licensed for that platform.
Beth: Oh yes, yes, yes.
Eli: That’s a no-no. I got in trouble once.
Beth: Oh. Did you?
Eli: I don’t remember—I think it was for I Will Survive by Gloria Gaynor.
Beth: Okay. We do—well, we know this very much so because you like—it’s a big business. So we use all royalty-free music in all of our videos. But on TikTok, I could in theory put something that is not—like it’s a big movie. Yeah. Stephenie would never let that happen.
Eli: They just make you take it down. It’s not the end of the world. I mean, although TikTok, you know, TikTok is like if you mess up a few times, they’re like, “You’re done.”
Beth: Really? Good to know. Okay. No, that was good though. Logistically a couple more things that I wanted to because—so when you started, you took three days to plan this out. Like a lot of this comes from—I mean, I think there’s no substitution for practice. I don’t—I always give this analogy of skiing, but like, nobody’s going to learn skiing in one day. Nobody’s going to learn to get on a black diamond in one season. It’s not how it works, like the things that you’re able to do creatively—this very like Fairy Psych Mother. When did that come like creatively? When did that come? And then like—
Eli: I mean, I think it probably was a good year before I even learned to cut clips like.
Beth: That’s the point I’m trying to make.
Eli: Yeah. And then I—and then I learned things like, oh, at the time, Instagram Reels were only one minute long. I was like, “I’m making my videos too long. That’s why they’re not.” Then I need to do that now for a minute and a half. But like, you’re just constantly learning, and it’s like—
Beth: If you’re showing up, if you’re showing up.
Eli: You also learn about what works for you and what doesn’t. So I have made videos that have done really well in terms of audience exposure, but that have not been good for me personally. So for instance, like challenging someone’s behavior online or being like—like controversial material—controversial does great on the internet, and I have done a few things that have been in line with my value system where I’m like, “I want to speak on this, I want to do this.” And then the stress…
Of dealing with the way that people are reacting to it, it wasn’t worth it for me. I learned a lot in that. So I think as you go forward, like you’re going to evolve—what you put out, what you don’t put out, how you feel in it, and then all of the editing stuff and the stuff changes. Like all of a sudden CapCut will roll out a new thing, and then you’re like, “Where is the auto captions button?” And you just have to spend a day like figuring out how that all works. But I like to have the control of all that. I like—for you, I—it, I don’t—I don’t love figuring it out when it’s hard, but I like that. I’m like, “I can make this video, edit this video, upload this video, and within, like maybe two—like all that can happen in two hours.” For me. Yeah. And then it’s out there. Right. And now I don’t have to do anything. And if I’m doing that batch kind of thing where I recorded all of them, and then maybe I spend the next day editing them, but then it’s like, “Hey, I’ve only spent two half days, and I have content for every single day this week,” and that’s great.
Beth: And this is—Mainstream exists for that second part, like the logistical part—that’s what we do. We can edit stuff for you. We can make it look, you know, down and dirty or fun or more professional, whatever that looks like. We can film it. We cannot—we cannot create. We can even sort of create the content because we can draw it out of you.
Beth: We cannot get you excited about the content. We cannot get you actually willing to go on camera, and that—and I mean, there’s like a—we’re talking about kind of a lot of different types of videos, and we do more stuff that’s more professionally produced.
Eli: It’s why I hired you to do those longer videos. I do not want to edit three-hour six modules and three hours of video and like, and make it look professional, like what I do on the internet. It doesn’t need to look perfect.
Beth: Totally, totally. And you are willing to learn CapCut, and you want to. And it’s fun for you and your skill set. But not everybody does. I mean, I like—like in-home stuff, we talk about this—like some people are really fine painting their own walls. Some people want to repair—like, Luke will do plumbing, but he’s not going to hire some—or we’re always going to hire someone for electrical, like we have our limits. So I think that. But the one thing—it’s kind of like push-ups, like in personal training—like, you know, cool. We can come up with a million different ways that you can be fit, but you have to do the push-ups, and that’s what you know—I want the logistical help. It’s possible to create a huge viral following.
Eli: I want people to know the internet has been way kinder than I expected.
Beth: Oh, okay. Good.
Eli: There are still moments—I’ve definitely been like, people still do terrible things and say terrible things, but not as much as people do kind.
Beth: At the rate. Okay.
Eli: No, not even close. And I think when you are offering something you really believe is helpful to the world and to an end—something you want out there—people feel that from you, and they get it, and they know that you’re putting yourself out there. They know that that feels like uncomfortable. And I think as more and more people are doing it, it’s less like, “Whoa, the people on the screen,” and it’s more like, “We’re all on the screen.”
Beth: Yeah. So, interesting.
Eli: I think there’s a shift in expectations around people as well. So I don’t know, the internet’s been kinder than I thought it would be. Trust the process and know that, like, you will have that moment. Like, I think everyone will have their moment. Like, just keep going, just keep swimming, just keep swimming~
Beth: Big theme.
Eli: Yeah.
Beth: And because you said, like your content creates your content—create your content like it’s all this like snowball effect.
Eli: And I’m actually not even doing that as well as I could. Like, I like—every post I make has like 200 or 300 comments.
Beth: Yeah, you keep mining that.
Eli: Totally, yeah, just boom. That’s a great question. I could make another video responding to that question. That’s something I need to do more of. You can make content that’s just like, “Hey, I have a question.”
Beth: “What do you think?” Why don’t people do this? Yeah, yeah.
Eli: Yeah. I’m like, okay, I’ll do that one later today. Also just came up with—yes, voyeurism is content like that. I just want—I did a video last week where all I did was show people how dirty my kitchen was.
Beth: Oh yeah.
Eli: It has some—has 70,000 likes because people are like, “That’s—you think—that’s what my kitchen looks like.” We’re all in this thing together. So I think like—don’t—you can also—like don’t overthink it. So write stuff down. All these little thoughts—like the internet is about sound bites. Social media is about connecting with people through sound bites. Just be you. Go bring your stuff. Go for it. And the worst thing that will happen is you don’t explode into a following that you expected to. And—and you just go, “Oh, I did it. I tried. That wasn’t—that wasn’t my space.” I know some people right now where I’m like, maybe it’s not your space.
Beth: Yeah, maybe this isn’t for you. Yeah. Okay.
Eli: Yeah. But like, I think for most people, like, it’s just like any other part of human life. There is a space for you. Yeah, yeah, there’s an audience for you. There are friends for you. Not everybody’s your people. I like to tell people there are way more people who don’t like me than do like me in the world.
Eli: Yeah. Way more.
Beth: That’s a good thing to remember.
Eli: My last month exposure was like 2.7 million people. But only 10,000 of those people followed.
Beth: Yeah.
Eli: So like from a statistics perspective, I’m not very likable.
Beth: No, it’s true. It’s—that’s.
Eli: Just saying—a lot more people are rejecting me and, but I just have to not think about—I actually don’t think about it because it’s like, “Well, they’re not my people. Who knows what’s going on.”
Beth: And I always like that quote about like, “Some people just don’t like peaches. There’s something wrong with the damn peach.” Like, it’s okay for people to not like you. Yes, that’s hard to do, too. Okay, you guys, this is obviously, hopefully interesting for you, too. Anything we missed?
Stephenie: I do think your point about—everyone’s online now. I know just from my own kids. My 17-year-old son couldn’t tell you who most Hollywood actors are. He doesn’t watch that, he watches YouTube.
Beth: The Online People.
Eli: He watches—yeah. He’s not a social media kid, but he definitely is. YouTube. Those people he knows.
Beth: Those are the famous people to him now.
Steph: Those are the famous people for him. He’ll be like, “How have you not heard of so-and-so?” and I’m like, “Because I’m 52 years old. That’s how I haven’t heard of them,” you know.
Eli: Well, and I think they know more people—like I think I think there’s just like more of an exposure.
Beth: It’s like democratizing on talent. On your talent. Yeah. Yeah.
Eli: 15 minutes of fame. Except for I think it’s becoming more of like, there’s a lot of hours and time in which we can connect with a lot of different people in the world because we have this avenue. And so instead of seeing it as, “Can I get famous or can I write?” it’s like, “What? Where are my people at? Who else here is like this? Who also here like that?” You know, and you will absolutely accidentally get shown to the people who are not your people, and they’ll say something terrible, and you’ll just go—
Beth: “Sorry about that.”
Eli: “Not my people.” You know, sometimes you block them, sometimes you—well, depends on my mood.
Beth: Yeah.
Eli: You know, sometimes I’m like, “I’m just going to leave that there and let you sit and think about what you’ve done.”
Beth: That somebody said that, and I thought that was perfect. Like, that’s not my bad behavior. That’s their bad behavior. And that should be put up there for all time. I like that response instead of just like deleting and blocking. I was like, that’s perfect.
Eli: Other times—other times, though, I’m like, “No one needs to see this.” Or like, “I don’t like you either.”
Beth: Right? Well, and I think being like—I think it’s funny because like, you’re—I fan-girl to you because you have built this audience, but like, you’re only famous to people who care about your subject. Like that is how it works. Like nobody’s like just yeah—
Eli: Also whenever people are like, “You’re famous,” I’m like, “No, I’m not. This is pretend famous.”
Beth: It’s very pretend famous—not pretend famous, but like, it is niche famous.
Eli: It’s like on the internet and like—and also I’m not famous for being like, I don’t know, Michael Jordan. I’m like, a lot of people know me because I talk a lot. And I keep popping up in their feeds.
Beth: Right, right, right, right.
Eli: Like, and I think like—
Beth: They care about what you have to say. And also like you—you also can cast a wider net because a lot of us are parents.
Beth: But there’s a lot of people that aren’t going to be turned on. I mean, there’s a lot of people that are like, “No, you need to control your kids,” or just like the antithesis of your message.
Eli: The amount people that do not like me—as, of course. I’m not everybody’s cup of tea. Yeah, but—and again, I think it helps to be 40. It helps. I’ve gone through a lot of therapy to be like, “Not everyone’s my cup of tea. I don’t need them to be.”
Beth: That’s more important. That’s what I’m hearing at—like those things are going to be more important—like solve those. Don’t worry about like what video you should make or how to use CapCut, like solve those.
Eli: What’s in the way of you authentically bringing yourself anywhere? Because bringing myself to you here, yeah, is actually not that different than bringing myself to a screen. It’s the same thing.
Beth: That’s—this is that is what I’m finding too.
Eli: I get feedback from you. Not necessarily from a screen, although I do watch myself. So I feel like I’m developing, like, a weird relationship with my face. You know, ’cause it’s strange. Maybe people don’t always do that. Do they always watch themselves when they record?
Beth: I think they probably do. I think it’s a combination—a lot of ways to skin a cat.
Eli: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyway, all that to be said, I think. Yeah. Like, what do you need in order to find rest and solitude and like, not solitude, rest and alliance with yourself and to be like, “Okay, let’s do this thing. I’m not thinking I matter more than other people. I just matter.”
Beth: Right?
Eli: I don’t matter more. I’m adding my voice to the chorus as opposed to, “I’m trying to get a solo.” That—I think that’s a huge thing. That’s a—if I’m out here trying to get the only solo that I think exists around this topic or moment or whatever, I’m going to pee my pants. But if I’m just like, “Hey, there’s a lot of people singing, and I want to add my voice to this.”
Beth: “I can be helpful.” Yeah, that’s going to make it more easier to get from point A to point video recorded point. Yeah. Exactly. All right. We—I’m getting very concerned about Erica not eating, so—Erica is like, “I haven’t been concerned about this.”
Eli: That was so fun.
Beth: That was so fun!
Eli: Thank you. I love what you’re doing. And anyone—anyone who wasn’t sure if they should book these people—book these people. I just had, like, the best day of recording my course ever.
Beth: Are you recording on this? That’s a testimonial!